Betters Pocket Trial

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Re: Betters Pocket Trial

Post by ray the beancounter on Sun Apr 03, 2016 6:37 pm

Posie did very well today to finish 3rd on a track that looked one of the roughest wet bogs that I have seen used for harness racing. After running 1750m in those conditions most horses looked exhausted and must have been the equivalent of running 2 miles on an all-weather surface.
It was no surprise to see that fellow syndicate horses Major Change and Major Star failed miserably and could not handle the conditions.
I think that most horses that ran today will need a few days to recover from todays run.
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Re: Betters Pocket Trial

Post by barryf on Thu Mar 31, 2016 7:24 pm

Des. I believe that The Faithful is capable of winning a Group One but with the other main contenders (omitting Have Faith In Me as he is spelling) being of pretty much equivalent ability he will need a good share of luck in the running and barrier draw plus, being in top physical shape  to do so.

What he has shown is he has  speed, stamina and courage so he has the necessary attributes.

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Re: Betters Pocket Trial

Post by Des Carruthers on Tue Mar 29, 2016 11:02 pm

The best Major Star would be a short priced favourite for the Country Cups final. The Bettors Pocket that won the Franklin Country Cup would be a huge chance off the front. He had a harder run against better opposition in that race and finished it off with good final sectionals that shut out the rest of the field. The two runs over the weekend, admittedly on grass, were way below that standard. Tijuana Bromac started off equal marks (mobile) on day one but gave Bettors Pocket a 30m start on the second day and still won. Do you think that Tony Herlihy will hand up the front in the final or try to replicate the all the way Franlkin Country Cup win? The overall statistics for ATC 2012 and ATC2014 are remarkable considering that a lot of yearlings that are purchased at the sales do not even make it to the races or have very limited racing careers (see ATC 2013). Of the five horses in those two syndicates we have won a group1, runner up in another three group 1 races and contested several other group 1 races with three different horses. I believe that The Faithful is capable of adding to the group one successes in the coming months. What does everyone else think?

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Re: Betters Pocket Trial

Post by Conwell on Mon Mar 28, 2016 10:10 pm

I wasn't overly disappointed with today's effort from Posie either, although I still favour Major Star over him in the final on Friday. (even on a grass track)

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Re: Betters Pocket Trial

Post by barryf on Mon Mar 28, 2016 4:32 pm

I wouldn't despair Des as Posie stays on the front.

Last year- Darcee 3rd. in the Hawera Cup in 4.01.9- , 4  1/2 lengths from the winner which started from 40 metres.Wins the final from the front.

This year Posie 5th. in 3.59.8, 3.7 lengths from the winner which started from 30 metres. Remains on the front.

Hope springs eternal! ( Even with Test cricket).

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Re: Betters Pocket Trial

Post by Des Carruthers on Mon Mar 28, 2016 3:25 pm

Message for barryf
I wasn't aware that there was any TEST cricket being played at the moment.

Another disappointing run from Bettors Pocket. He can't win the Country Cups final on that run. Go Major Star.

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Re: Betters Pocket Trial

Post by barryf on Mon Mar 28, 2016 10:29 am

Message for Des-

C R I C K E T !

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Re: Betters Pocket Trial

Post by barryf on Sun Mar 27, 2016 9:26 pm

Looks like we are on the same page, Conwell.

It is a discretionary handicap so I guess the handicapper can make his own judgment calls, difficult to reconcile as they may be.

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Re: Betters Pocket Trial

Post by Conwell on Sun Mar 27, 2016 9:22 pm

Ah, you just beat me to it Barry!! A nose decision. Very Happy

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Re: Betters Pocket Trial

Post by Conwell on Sun Mar 27, 2016 9:20 pm

So Posie will be lining up in the Hawera Cup tomorrow.  Very Happy

The conditions for the race are listed as:

For C3 & faster 4yo-&-older pacers. This race is included in the NORTHERN COUNTRY CUP SERIES. C4 & Faster mares receive a 10-metre Handicapping Concession.

So can anyone explain why Zacspatrol, a C4 male horse, is starting off the front line while all 3 of the other C4 male horses are starting off 10m?  Question
Same goes for Macs Creation who is a C6 male horse starting off 10m when there is a C5 male horse starting off 20m? Question

There clearly must be other conditions that they haven't shared with us on the hrnz website, but I can't make sense of it.
It can't be win or lifetime earnings as Zacspatrol (a C4 male horse off the front) is above Scanreco Bay (a C4 male horse off 10m) in both of these accounts.

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Re: Betters Pocket Trial

Post by barryf on Sun Mar 27, 2016 9:20 pm

I thought the handicapper was a bit generous in placing Zakspatrol, runner up the first day and an 8 race winner holding a C4 assessment, on the front with the c3's and c4 mares. He looks to be preempting a looming drop back should he not win tomorrow which is a bit generous.

With better B Amazed and Bettor Dream having dropped out from the noms.,the race looks pretty open.  The 3000 metres might test a few.

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Re: Betters Pocket Trial

Post by Des Carruthers on Sun Mar 27, 2016 9:07 pm

A bit disappointing for Bettors Pocket to finish third from behind the leader / winner but may have needed the run. Every horse seemed to hold it's position from the top of the straight to the finishing post. Bettors Pocket now gets a 30m start on the winner in the Hawera Cup on Monday. Mischief Maker who is about 5th in the Country Cups rankings has been exported to USA so that may also help Major Change to get a start if that is the intention of the trainer. I wonder if he is going well enough to be competitive in the final if he gets a start? I am still very hopeful for a Major Star / Bettors Pocket quinella in the final.

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Re: Betters Pocket Trial

Post by barryf on Sat Mar 26, 2016 2:49 pm

Keep close to Keith so we can be sure of getting a close up of you all on Trackside! Wave :

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Bettors Pocket

Post by nealclan on Sat Mar 26, 2016 2:32 pm

We are going to New Plymouth for the final with Keith & Merle Treadaway

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Re: Betters Pocket Trial

Post by Conwell on Fri Mar 25, 2016 8:39 pm

I contacted Rob today to point out that Posie isn't nominated for the Hawera Country Cup on Monday. Rob emailed me back and advised that he'd also noticed this and had contacted Tony about it and Tony has assured him that Posie will be transferred to the Hawera Cup.

So fair not, the ATC syndicates will have 2 horses eligible for the Country Cup final on 1st April.
Is anyone else planning on traveling to New Plymouth to watch it?

We also have a (very) outside chance of having 3 runners in the final with Major Change sitting 18= place in the rankings on 4 points. One of the horses ahead of him is Risk who won the Manawatu Cup last weekend but has only contested one Country Cup race so won't be eligible for the final.

The field limit for New Plymouth is listed as:

Grass-1600–distances run 1700, 1750, 1800, 2600 mobile, mobiles 14 (9+5) Stands 14 (9+5) overall 16

I'm unsure whether this means that there will be 14 or 16 starters in the Country Cup final. I think it means that you can have 16 runners off a range of different marks but only 9+5 if they are all off the front. If so that means that Change will still need someone else ahead of him in the rankings to not go on and contest the final to get a spot. (and for no one else to pass him on the points table in the Hawera Cup of which the only 2 dangers are Tijuana Bromac and Brydon Delight)

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Re: Betters Pocket Trial

Post by barryf on Tue Mar 22, 2016 2:00 pm

Just had a look at the conditions of nominations and found this:-
5. ONE NOMINATION PER HORSE: Trainers are advised that a horse may only be nominated for One Race at this meeting. Trainers do however have the right to Transfer their horse(s) following the close of Nominations. The Club reserves the right to transfer any horse deemed necessary, unless trainers specify that their horse(s) is NOT to be Transferred.

Hopefully this gives us another option.

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Re: Betters Pocket Trial

Post by barryf on Tue Mar 22, 2016 1:53 pm

Very odd Ray in that the phone message refers to Posie having the first day run prior to racing in the Hawera Cup the second day.

Seems like a miscommunication by somebody.

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Re: Betters Pocket Trial

Post by ray the beancounter on Tue Mar 22, 2016 1:43 pm

The noms are now showing on the HRNZ website for the second day of the Hawera meeting and Posie has not been nominated for the Hawera Cup, which is the country cups race I understood that was being targeted.
Under the series conditions a start is required in at least two country cups series races to be eligible for the country cups series final. Posie is instead nominated for a 2000m class race on the second day of the meeting.
Conclusion: Tony doesn't consider him good enough to be in the country cups final....
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Re: Betters Pocket Trial

Post by barryf on Tue Mar 22, 2016 11:55 am

I believe you are correct Ray in that Posie was not nominated initially for the first day so obviously a late change of mind by Tony.

Hopefully he would be looking for a soft run on the first day, then ensure himself a start in the Country Cups final by also racing on the second day.  Posie is a big strong horse which should be able to handle the 2 days of racing, close together, hopefully without having a gut buster first up.

Reviewing the 2 days at Manawatu , the horses which finished 2,3 4 on the first day were down the track, or scratched  on the second day, while those which placed 6,7 & 8 on the first day were 2,3 and 4 the second day.

So draw your own conclusions, people!

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Re: Betters Pocket Trial

Post by ray the beancounter on Tue Mar 22, 2016 10:34 am

When I first checked the initial noms yesterday morning for the first day of racing at Hawera I am certain that Bettors Pocket was not listed - I checked the index at the bottom and didn't see his name listed. Some noms were held open for an hour or two and it must have been during this time that Posie was subsequently added to he first day noms. It was thus as a bit of a surprise that I got a text advising that he had drawn number 6 in race 10 on Saturday.
Seemed an odd decision to include him as I was of the impression that the main aim of the trip to Hawera was to start him in the country cups race on the second day of the meeting on the Monday. This would qualify him for the country cups final on 1st April and would hopefully earn him some more series points.
That race on Monday is a 3000m race and if there is any rain between now and then (which is guaranteed with heavy rain forecast for Wed and Thu this week) then the 3000m trip over a sticky track can be a gut-buster. So why would you then start him two days earlier as well in a 2100m race.
He is racing in good form at the moment but remember; his recent win was on an all weather track not on grass, he is not a star but a good honest average-ability horse, 5100m over a 48 hour period is asking a lot.
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Re: Betters Pocket Trial

Post by barryf on Wed Mar 16, 2016 4:02 pm

Looks to be following a similar pattern to Tony's Country Cups winner last year in Darcee.  He had only 2 starts on grass prior to contesting the final but that was at Manawatu so struck an all weather surface which won't happen this year.

Also, Darcee got in on the front via 2 placings so had a further advantage there.

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Re: Betters Pocket Trial

Post by ray the beancounter on Tue Mar 15, 2016 9:31 pm

Hi Des. Secondhand information that I have received is that Bettors Pocket is to bypass Manawatu and will instead be nominated for the grass track meeting at Hawera over the Easter weekend. Whether he will race both the Saturday and Monday is unknown to me, as he may just race on the second day (the Monday) in the Hawera Cup. He needs to race in one more of the Country Cup races to be eligible for the Country Cup final on Friday 1st April at New Plymouth on the grass.
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Re: Betters Pocket Trial

Post by Des Carruthers on Tue Mar 15, 2016 6:16 pm

I note that Bettors Pocket was not nominated for the Manawatu weekend. Is everything OK after his excellent win last week? Is he still going to contest the Country Cup series or does he now have a different objective?

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Re: Betters Pocket Trial

Post by Des Carruthers on Wed Mar 09, 2016 1:10 am

I listened for the "Whoopees" on the replay but could not hear them so you need more volume next time. What a really good drive ... to work to the lead after a slowish start and to win untouched by 2 1/2 lengths running the 4th slowest overall time yet coming home in 57.5 and 28.2 over the long trip - beautifully rated. Bettors Pocket is becoming as reliable and as interesting as The Faithful. It is good to see that Zac Butcher is driving The Faithful on Friday rather than the more fancied Hug the Wind. I have a cricket Grand Final on Saturday so I am looking for two wins to celebrate over the weekend. Several punters in my team have been following my horses so I hope that they got on Bettors Pocket to make up for the thirds and fourths since The Faithful won on New Years Eve.

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Re: Betters Pocket Trial

Post by barryf on Tue Mar 08, 2016 6:00 pm

Lots of "Whoopees" at the Park today as Posie confirmed his ability as a stayer when he led virtually throughout and maintained a steady tempo to finish it off in the fastest final sectional of the day in 57.5s and 28.2 and to score decisively by 2 3/4 lengths.

A good muster of members sampled the club's liquid refreshments and enjoyed the congratulations from the Franklin Club representative and the sponsor, The Stables Cafe.

Apparently the Cup is a first and goes to the syndicate ( lucky draw coming up?) while the framed photograph, taken in the winners' circle, will hang in the Stables Cafe at Alex Park. Much appreciated.

I understand the Country Cups programme remains on Posie's agenda so it looks like we will have 2  or 3 horses targeting that final.

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